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operatives out of the fattah, out of afghanistan and pakistan. killed a lot of them. including bin laden. this is a global movement. senior u.s. intelligence officials acknowledge the arab spring, long-i'm ally sideline or degraded regional intelligence services and the weapons fuel capability of the islamist group. >> bret: iran and syria are threatening action against israel for airstrike inside syria wednesday. syria says israel hit a research facility. conor powell is sorting through things in jerusalem. >> syria's bloody civil war could be on the brink of expanding beyond the borders. as assad regime vowed to retaliation on airstrike on weapons convoy inside syria. u.s. officials confirm the strike on the convoy which was believed to be carrying sophisticated russian made fa-17. surface-to-air missiles from syria to t hezbollah fighters in lebanon. world leaders have long feared that the chaos of the syrian civil war would lead to transfer of weapons to extremist groups. syria denied weapons and claimed that israeli jets attacked a military facility outside damas
operatives out of the fattah, out of afghanistan and pakistan. killed a lot of them. including bin laden. this is a global movement. senior u.s. intelligence officials acknowledge the arab spring, long-i'm ally sideline or degraded regional intelligence services and the weapons fuel capability of the islamist group. >> bret: iran and syria are threatening action against israel for airstrike inside syria wednesday. syria says israel hit a research facility. conor powell is sorting through...
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started for me in two thousand and two i had been the chief of counterterrorism operations for the cia in pakistan i returned to headquarters early in the summer of two thousand and two and a senior officer approached me to ask if i was interested in being trained in so-called enhanced interrogation techniques torture techniques i told him that i had a moral problem with them i didn't want to be associated with the program and i moved on to a different job so in two thousand and seven or by two thousand and seven human rights watch and amnesty international in the red cross had reported that that there were credible reports that the cia was was torturing prisoners and president bush at the time said we don't torture we're not engaging. torture and if anyone is being tortured it's because of rogue cia officers well that just was simply not true so i want on a.b.c. news to talk about the capture of up was a beta the reporter asked me if i was a beta had been tortured i said he had and i said that it was torture and that it was official u.s. government policy the very next day the cia filed what's ca
started for me in two thousand and two i had been the chief of counterterrorism operations for the cia in pakistan i returned to headquarters early in the summer of two thousand and two and a senior officer approached me to ask if i was interested in being trained in so-called enhanced interrogation techniques torture techniques i told him that i had a moral problem with them i didn't want to be associated with the program and i moved on to a different job so in two thousand and seven or by two...
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he traveled in the '90s in afghanistan and pakistan. he has the ability, i believe, to get operatives outside of that region and i think the intelligence committee supports that as well. that makes it a credible threat and something that you have to absolutely take seriously. >> and when he says these jihadist websites that he's planning some horrendous or huge attack against france or denmark or other countries in europe, does he have the capability for a huge attack as opposed to something more modest? >> well, there's always a little marketing in their efforts. the whole idea of terror is to create chaos and fear in large scale. some of that you have to take with a grain of salt. however, in their mind, the taking of the gas facility in eastern algeria was a huge success for him. it got them recruits and they knew this was not going to end well for them but that wasn't their purpose. it was a strategic change to go from taking people for ransom money to making a political statement about french -- france being in mali. that is a scar
he traveled in the '90s in afghanistan and pakistan. he has the ability, i believe, to get operatives outside of that region and i think the intelligence committee supports that as well. that makes it a credible threat and something that you have to absolutely take seriously. >> and when he says these jihadist websites that he's planning some horrendous or huge attack against france or denmark or other countries in europe, does he have the capability for a huge attack as opposed to...
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more than 300 in pakistan last year since obama took office. so it's something that obama's come to rely on very much but we still haven't clarified the legalities. >> and international opposed to domestic. harold ford jr. on "morning joe" today and former congressman, obviously, and he pointed out he get it is controversy and the moral issue but when it comes to putting boots on the ground, see it is logic in using drones in that respect. and i think a lot of people might agree with him to save a life of a soldier using a drone and then talking about domestically, people change. no one wants a drone over the home growing pot or not and some of the usage of the law enforcement personnel. >> sure. by the way, we right now are the only drone superpower. that's not to stay the same. drones are not hard to fly. other countries will be using them. we have to think about the precedent we are setting on the international scene for the use of drones. we fly them in to other people's countries and kill people there. if somebody did that to us, we'd be u
more than 300 in pakistan last year since obama took office. so it's something that obama's come to rely on very much but we still haven't clarified the legalities. >> and international opposed to domestic. harold ford jr. on "morning joe" today and former congressman, obviously, and he pointed out he get it is controversy and the moral issue but when it comes to putting boots on the ground, see it is logic in using drones in that respect. and i think a lot of people might agree...
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consider it immoral initially i said in two thousand and two that it was immoral when i returned from pakistan to cia headquarters in the summer early in the summer of two thousand and two i was asked by a senior officer in the cia's counterterrorist center if i wanted to be trained in the use of torture techniques and i told him that i had a moral problem with these techniques i believed that they were wrong and i didn't want to have anything to do with the torture program what if torture had been efficient would it would you have found a great to support then no no i grew up in a very pious greek orthodox home and you know we were we were instilled from a very young age with with a very clear sense of right and wrong and i believed from the beginning that torture was wrong it's no secret that obama's administration has been especially harsh on whistle blow was but can the u.s. afford leniency in these security sensitive times. well see this is i think this is exactly what the problem is in this post nine eleven atmosphere that we find ourselves in we have been losing our civil liberties incr
consider it immoral initially i said in two thousand and two that it was immoral when i returned from pakistan to cia headquarters in the summer early in the summer of two thousand and two i was asked by a senior officer in the cia's counterterrorist center if i wanted to be trained in the use of torture techniques and i told him that i had a moral problem with these techniques i believed that they were wrong and i didn't want to have anything to do with the torture program what if torture had...
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consider it immoral initially i sent in two thousand and two that it was immoral when i returned from pakistan to cia headquarters in the summer early in the summer of two thousand and two i was asked by a senior officer in the cia's counterterrorist center if i wanted to be. techniques and i told him that i had a moral problem with these techniques i believed that they were wrong and i didn't want to have anything to do with the torture program what if torture had been efficient would it would you have found a great to support ben no no i grew up in a very pious greek orthodox home and you know we were we were instilled from a very young age with with a very clear sense of right and wrong and i believed from the beginning that torture was wrong it's no secret that obama's administration has been especially harsh on whistle blow was but can the u.s. afford leniency in the security sensitive times. well see this is i think this is exactly what the problem is in this post nine eleven atmosphere that we find ourselves in we have been losing our civil liberties incrementally over the last decade t
consider it immoral initially i sent in two thousand and two that it was immoral when i returned from pakistan to cia headquarters in the summer early in the summer of two thousand and two i was asked by a senior officer in the cia's counterterrorist center if i wanted to be. techniques and i told him that i had a moral problem with these techniques i believed that they were wrong and i didn't want to have anything to do with the torture program what if torture had been efficient would it would...
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and pakistan was where i was at the time. and the larger context of that was nuclear powers which certainly pakistan is part of that. and not unlike what secretary gates said on a strike on iran. my point was that this would not be a preferable option land the would be consequences to this option. things would happen as a result of it. if we could find a better option or way to deal with iran to assure they do not get nuclear weapons, then we are far better off. that was the context of that statement. >> i know my time is up and we will have an opportunity for a second round of questions, but as i see your quote it didn't say preferable it said it was not a preferable option so i look forward to following up in the second round of questioning. thank you. >> thank you senator ayotte. senator mansion? >> thank you so much senator hagel for your services and your family for your services. i'd like to say this. you and i have not known each other before. i've never had the pleasure of serving with you, which i wish i woufment you
and pakistan was where i was at the time. and the larger context of that was nuclear powers which certainly pakistan is part of that. and not unlike what secretary gates said on a strike on iran. my point was that this would not be a preferable option land the would be consequences to this option. things would happen as a result of it. if we could find a better option or way to deal with iran to assure they do not get nuclear weapons, then we are far better off. that was the context of that...
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i think pakistan is another very complicated reality, but staying on iran, i think we're far smarter to do with president has been doing, which i laid out in my book. i have a chapter on iran, two chapters on iraq, and a chapter on the middle east. getting the world community behind us with these u.n. sanctioned sanctions through the security council of the united nations, these are tough sanctions and they are having a tremendous impact. you know that. if the military option is the only when required, we are always on higher ground in every way, international law, domestic law, people of the world, people of the region to be with us on this. if we have tried and gone through this in a responsible way, everything i have said in my book was about that. i don't have a problem with engaging. i think engagement is clearly in our interest. that's not negotiation. engaged in is not appeasement or surrender. i think the time is right, the climate is right, the dynamics are right, we should find ways if we can. we cannot force it, but i think we are always smarter and wiser to take that appr
i think pakistan is another very complicated reality, but staying on iran, i think we're far smarter to do with president has been doing, which i laid out in my book. i have a chapter on iran, two chapters on iraq, and a chapter on the middle east. getting the world community behind us with these u.n. sanctioned sanctions through the security council of the united nations, these are tough sanctions and they are having a tremendous impact. you know that. if the military option is the only when...
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the new technology developed in iran with the hef pakistan would be able to enrich uranium two to three times faster. it's believed iran plans to install about 3,000 of these newer, faster machines. iran is believed to have enough highly enriched uranium to build a new nuclear bombs but would have to overcome other technological hurdles before it can do that, martha. martha: we'll be watching it. bill: there is new fallout over obamacare. why some of the legislation's more vocal supporters aren't so sure about it any more. we'll explain that. martha: woe, just when you thought the whole dead girlfriend hoax thing could not get any weirder there is a new twist in this one now, believe it or not. the mastermind of the scheme behind it all breaks his silence. wait until you hear what he's revealing about this. bill: a look inside iran's most brutal prison where an american pastor has now been sentenced to eight years this week alone. what life is like inside of a quote, living hell. what is this pastor then up against in this jail? >> he's up against insanity, that's what he's up against.
the new technology developed in iran with the hef pakistan would be able to enrich uranium two to three times faster. it's believed iran plans to install about 3,000 of these newer, faster machines. iran is believed to have enough highly enriched uranium to build a new nuclear bombs but would have to overcome other technological hurdles before it can do that, martha. martha: we'll be watching it. bill: there is new fallout over obamacare. why some of the legislation's more vocal supporters...
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. >>> a medical hurdle for a courageous young girl shot in the head by the taliban in pakistan simply because she wanted an education. the 15-year-old will undergo a final delicate operation before resuming a normal life. as abc's nick schifrin reports this survivor is truly an inspiration. >> reporter: malala yousafzai's future begins in this lab, with that piece of titanium. >> it might need adjusted. >> reporter: it will cover a three-inch-wide hole in her skull, caused three months ago after a taliban gunman shot her point blank. the bullet passed through the red line. yet she survived. as she recuperated, she became a global icon of courage, elegant advocate for girls' education. and once dr. stephen edmondson is done shaping titanium so it fits her skull she can restart her life. >> not only does it recontour the skull, it protects the brain as well. >> reporter: the bullet affected her hearing. she'll need a cochlear implant to know where sound is coming from. after her surgery she will remain in the hospital for less than a week and will need a year and a half to make a full r
. >>> a medical hurdle for a courageous young girl shot in the head by the taliban in pakistan simply because she wanted an education. the 15-year-old will undergo a final delicate operation before resuming a normal life. as abc's nick schifrin reports this survivor is truly an inspiration. >> reporter: malala yousafzai's future begins in this lab, with that piece of titanium. >> it might need adjusted. >> reporter: it will cover a three-inch-wide hole in her skull,...
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in 2002, and was the chief counter-terrorism of operations for the cia in pakistan. my job was to try to locate al qaeda fighters were al qaeda leaders and capture them to turn them over to the justice department's and have them face trial. that was the original idea, not to have them sit in cuba for the next decade. but we caught abu zubaydah. he was shot three times by pakistani police as he was tried to escape from his safe house. i was the first person to have custody of him, to sit with him. we spoke to each other extensively. we talked about everything from september 11 to poetry he had been writing to his family. then he was moved on to a secret prison after that. once i got back to headquarters, i heard he had been subject to harsh techniques, then called enhanced interrogation techniques, and i was asked by one of the leaders in this tsa's counter-terrorism center if i wanted to be trained in these of these techniques. i told them i had a moral problem with them and did not want to be involved. fast forward to 2007, by then, human-rights watch and in this in
in 2002, and was the chief counter-terrorism of operations for the cia in pakistan. my job was to try to locate al qaeda fighters were al qaeda leaders and capture them to turn them over to the justice department's and have them face trial. that was the original idea, not to have them sit in cuba for the next decade. but we caught abu zubaydah. he was shot three times by pakistani police as he was tried to escape from his safe house. i was the first person to have custody of him, to sit with...
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that will get rid of terrorism in afghanistan it moved the problems for the british and americans to pakistan then we were told suddenly al qaida has spread to the middle east now we're told we've got al qaida in the macweb now whatever the truth is about what exactly all these groups represent what you're finding is after eleven years of the war on terror more grievances against western powers more terrorist groups more five food there is and until there is a political solution to the grievances and to the problems that rover than the whole of interventions that are becoming more and more of a pattern in german i'm going to have to you are not saying like we are today i'm very sorry but i've just run out of time with you thank you very much i will tell you i'm here in london based activists from stop the war coalition lindsey german. egypt's opposition send a clear message to the president they want to see mohamed morsi for urgent talks after almost a week of deadly unrest as we lost going to the engine starts publishing deals this is a shortened by jail cell phone that's in a few minutes. a
that will get rid of terrorism in afghanistan it moved the problems for the british and americans to pakistan then we were told suddenly al qaida has spread to the middle east now we're told we've got al qaida in the macweb now whatever the truth is about what exactly all these groups represent what you're finding is after eleven years of the war on terror more grievances against western powers more terrorist groups more five food there is and until there is a political solution to the...
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the drones we see in pakistan and other places. also in north africa and yemen sometimes when they fire the missiles and take out targets from the air. these are going to be just for surveillance, out there gathering intelligence. the thing you are talking about in this neighborhood is it is hard to have human intelligence. the cia has a network of people that give them information. in this part of the world, in this neighborhood, they don't. they have little intel. the drones will be up there looking for movements of groups they are worried about. >> do we think there is significant numbers of al qaeda in niger? >> in the neighborhood. this is the concern in mali. what happened in the north when the al qaeda linked groups, the islamists came over to take over what was a separatist regime at the time and hijacked it, you have groups spread across this area that encompasses many countries. you can see they are starting to work together. that worries a lot of people. >> i don't know if you can answer this question. how much does this
the drones we see in pakistan and other places. also in north africa and yemen sometimes when they fire the missiles and take out targets from the air. these are going to be just for surveillance, out there gathering intelligence. the thing you are talking about in this neighborhood is it is hard to have human intelligence. the cia has a network of people that give them information. in this part of the world, in this neighborhood, they don't. they have little intel. the drones will be up there...
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last since bush and obama what is really change trey's first strike wars in afghanistan and yemen and pakistan and now they're positioning so-called missiles defense which is essentially a first rate weapon targeted assassinations intensified under obama and its assertion of his right to order the killing of american citizens anywhere in the world is kerry going to stand up in international forums and say no that's wrong we can't do that i don't think so neither did hillary clinton. and the gates of sexual abuse against russian child services authorities in moscow seems just as wild feeling of the newly implemented ban on american adoptions still runs high. egypt's opposition has called for an urgent meeting with the president and ministers to end the violence in the country and mohamed morsi is in itself is currently in berlin to negotiate a partnership agreement he had planned to visit paris nights but decided to head back home instead violent protests in egypt have been going on for almost a week and resulted in over fifty deaths thousands have been calling for an end to morsi is rule clash
last since bush and obama what is really change trey's first strike wars in afghanistan and yemen and pakistan and now they're positioning so-called missiles defense which is essentially a first rate weapon targeted assassinations intensified under obama and its assertion of his right to order the killing of american citizens anywhere in the world is kerry going to stand up in international forums and say no that's wrong we can't do that i don't think so neither did hillary clinton. and the...
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but in a place like afghanistan or even pakistan, what you are really counting on is the host nation forces standing up and doing their part to control areas of the ground on the population. and then in combination, they can be very effective. stuart: general, i want to talk about your book because i have actually read much of it. my share of the task. it is a good book. very easy read. to me it was almost like a thriller. it was great stuff. i have a question for you, you are obviously a very talented man, in the military, brilliant organizer, how are you going to put those talents to work in the civilian life? >> well, it's interesting, when i left the service, i cofounded a group called mcchrystal group, and what we do is we're about half former special operators and half bright young civilians and we work with some major corporations, hewlett-packard, scotts miracle gro, sea gate technologies and we help them make the kinds of changes that we found were necessary particularly in the joint special operations command in iraq from 03 to 08. i found the similarities striking. stuart:
but in a place like afghanistan or even pakistan, what you are really counting on is the host nation forces standing up and doing their part to control areas of the ground on the population. and then in combination, they can be very effective. stuart: general, i want to talk about your book because i have actually read much of it. my share of the task. it is a good book. very easy read. to me it was almost like a thriller. it was great stuff. i have a question for you, you are obviously a very...
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help, when you hear this and the way egypt looks like it's dividing itself, it seems reminiscent of pakistan and how its fledgling democracy works between the civilian and the military relationship. >> well, there are a lot of the chronic problems in egypt. no doubt for six years, egypt's major institution was the military. they were the major power brokers, in fact, all of the previous leaders of this country came from the military. mohamed morsi is the first civilian leader to be elected. a lot of people feel that the military and the muslim brotherhood have cut a deal. a lot of people feel the military still pulse a lot of strings behind the scenes of what is happening here. you have a lot of institutional problems in the state as the country tries to grapple with new realities of trying to build democratic institutions that for so many years have been anything but c democratic. >> how can morsi end this crisis? >>. >> well, right now, he feels he has a democratic mandate. he has a large popular base of support. he won the elections. his constitution was passed in a nationwide referendum.
help, when you hear this and the way egypt looks like it's dividing itself, it seems reminiscent of pakistan and how its fledgling democracy works between the civilian and the military relationship. >> well, there are a lot of the chronic problems in egypt. no doubt for six years, egypt's major institution was the military. they were the major power brokers, in fact, all of the previous leaders of this country came from the military. mohamed morsi is the first civilian leader to be...
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he served as an unofficial envoy to president obama to pakistan and some countries that probably none of us know where he went. there are many times he's come to me and said, i've got to go, and he tells me where he's going, thouing in the newspapers about -- nothing in the newspapers about where he'd gone. but he is a great evaluator of people, and because of that, the president trusts him and has sent him on all these missions. now he will do that as secretary of state. he's authored numerous pieces of legislation to prevent the global spread of h.i.v. aids. he also played a central role in crafting our policy in iraq and afghanistan in the war on traimpleterror. i can remember one time where he spent days and days with president karzai working 0en a difficult issue following the elections that they had there. he'he's been focused on the mide east peace process and israel's security forays entire time on the foreign relations committee. for more than 30 years senator kerry has been a powerful voice for his constituents in massachusetts as well as an engaged citizen of the world. thr
he served as an unofficial envoy to president obama to pakistan and some countries that probably none of us know where he went. there are many times he's come to me and said, i've got to go, and he tells me where he's going, thouing in the newspapers about -- nothing in the newspapers about where he'd gone. but he is a great evaluator of people, and because of that, the president trusts him and has sent him on all these missions. now he will do that as secretary of state. he's authored numerous...
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. >> this program gave us an enormous amount of information about al qaeda in pakistan. the administration continues to use the intelligence every day in drone strikes. it is not just actable intelligence but how they operate. since the program was shut down we have seen the emergence of al qaeda in the arabian peninsula. we have had the emergence of al-shabab merging with al qaeda central. and al qaeda in africa. are we struggling in a way? the information we have on pakistan and the lack of information, is it harder to get the intelligence we need because we do not have this tool? >> one of the most important threads of information that i saw when i got there and still in 2006, late in the game, was detainee information. i already suggested to you that i am willing to adjust the detainee program. we have other penetrations and sources and knowledge. we have a better sense of the imminence of attack, what state of danger we are in as a nation. i told you we entered the black side in 2006. - the black site into a dozen sex. -- in 2006. lazy journalists sometimes they we
. >> this program gave us an enormous amount of information about al qaeda in pakistan. the administration continues to use the intelligence every day in drone strikes. it is not just actable intelligence but how they operate. since the program was shut down we have seen the emergence of al qaeda in the arabian peninsula. we have had the emergence of al-shabab merging with al qaeda central. and al qaeda in africa. are we struggling in a way? the information we have on pakistan and the...
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the last since bush obama what is really change trey's first strike wars in afghanistan and yemen and pakistan and now they're positioning so-called missiles the fence on the turkish russian border which is essentially a first rate weapon targeted assassinations intensified under obama and his assertion of his ready to order the killing of american citizens anywhere in the world is curie going to stand up in international forums and say no that's wrong we can't do that i don't think so neither did hillary clinton egypt's opposition has unexpectedly called for an urgent meeting with the country's president just days after forcefully rejecting any chance for dialogue meanwhile mohamed morsy himself is in europe despite the ongoing to master turmoil he is meeting german and french leaders hoping to convince them of his democratic intentions to get foreign funding and egypt's been plagued by bloody street battles for a week with protesters demanding an end to the rule of morsi and the muslim brotherhood blaming them for hijacking and protecting the revolution egyptian defense ministers warn the co
the last since bush obama what is really change trey's first strike wars in afghanistan and yemen and pakistan and now they're positioning so-called missiles the fence on the turkish russian border which is essentially a first rate weapon targeted assassinations intensified under obama and his assertion of his ready to order the killing of american citizens anywhere in the world is curie going to stand up in international forums and say no that's wrong we can't do that i don't think so neither...
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the last since bush obama what is really change trey's first strike wars in afghanistan and yemen and pakistan and now they're positioning so-called missiles to fence on the turkish russian border which is essentially a first rate weapon targeted assassinations intensified under obama and his assertion of his right to order the killing of american citizens anywhere in the world is kerry going to stand up an international forums and say no that's wrong we can't do that i don't think so neither did hillary clinton. with a little change expected in washington's foreign policy some u.s. secrets are likely to remain hidden overseas later on we analyze the investigation into cia prisons all and dragging on for five years and has had little assistance from america we try to shed some light on the issue about an. ongoing turmoil on the streets of egypt threatens to push the country towards collapse the stark warning came from the fans minister as violent protests show no sign of relenting at a government demonstrators continue to defy president morsi is curfew clashing with police and troops in cities
the last since bush obama what is really change trey's first strike wars in afghanistan and yemen and pakistan and now they're positioning so-called missiles to fence on the turkish russian border which is essentially a first rate weapon targeted assassinations intensified under obama and his assertion of his right to order the killing of american citizens anywhere in the world is kerry going to stand up an international forums and say no that's wrong we can't do that i don't think so neither...
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the globe on behalf of the obama administration, helping mend strained relations with afghanistan and pakistan. during kerry's nomination, president obama called him the perfect person for the job. >> i think it's fair to say that few individuals know as many presidents and prime ministers or grasp our foreign policies as firmly as john kerry. and this makes him a perfect choice to guide american diplomacy in the years ahead. >> meanwhile, in a shocking move, wisconsin senator ron johnson voted for john kerry's confirmation today. see, on thursday johnson was kind of put in his place by senator kerry after trying to make a scene over benghazi. >> will you work with me then on an ongoing basis so we can get that behind us, so we can find out what actually happened and we can move beyond that. can you just make that commitment to me? >> i think, senator, in all fairness, i think we do know what happened. i think that it is very clear. were you at the briefing with the tapes? >> no. >> well, there was a briefing with tapes which we all saw, those of us who went to it. which made it crystal clear.
the globe on behalf of the obama administration, helping mend strained relations with afghanistan and pakistan. during kerry's nomination, president obama called him the perfect person for the job. >> i think it's fair to say that few individuals know as many presidents and prime ministers or grasp our foreign policies as firmly as john kerry. and this makes him a perfect choice to guide american diplomacy in the years ahead. >> meanwhile, in a shocking move, wisconsin senator ron...
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look at pakistan where the president has gone all-in on drones six times more attacks by drones under president obama than under george w. bush. pakistanis, 94% of them think drones kill innocent people. what do we get out of this? >> here's the trade-off. the problem is, this part of africa is one of the big problem spots for the u.s. intelligence community. i travel with general carter hamm, head of the military's africa command, this month and he told me this is one of the real blind spots for u.s. intelligence agencies. they don't have good ways of collecting intelligence. they don't have good spy networks on the ground. so introducing these drones will get a head start on trying to monitor some of these militant networks including the al qaeda affiliate there. >> people might say who cares about drones. lot of people in this country say look, we don't want to risk american lives. if we're going to have to fly over and kill quote, unquote bad guys with drones, so be it. let's do it. there are people on the left and the right who agree about that. they say what about the pakistanis
look at pakistan where the president has gone all-in on drones six times more attacks by drones under president obama than under george w. bush. pakistanis, 94% of them think drones kill innocent people. what do we get out of this? >> here's the trade-off. the problem is, this part of africa is one of the big problem spots for the u.s. intelligence community. i travel with general carter hamm, head of the military's africa command, this month and he told me this is one of the real blind...